The Tarot Garden Library
About the Authors
Karen Mahony and Alex Ukolov are the
co-founders and owners of Baba*
studios in Prague, Czech Republic. Their
critically-acclaimed Tarot
of Prague is the first of many planned tarots to be
published by their studio.
Dan Pelletier is the
co-owner of The Tarot Garden. An accomplished tarot reader
with over thirty years of experience, Dan has also
contributed to such publications as Aeclectic Tarot
and Body Mind Spirit magazine.
|
The Art, Architecture, and History of Prague in
Tarot:
A Tarot
Garden Interview with Karen Mahony
and Alex Ukolov of Baba Studios
|
|
As interest in tarot continues to
spread worldwide, more and more individuals have
sought ways of expressing their own world-view
through the cards. The creation and publication
of new tarot decks is at an all-time high,
albeit with a mixed variety of results.
However, one rising star that has caught the
attention of the tarot community is Baba*
studios. Located in the Czech Republic, this
small publishing firm has developed a
well-deserved reputation for solid research and
quality products. Karen Mahony and Alex Ukolov,
the creative forces behind the company's
success, recently agreed to answer some
questions about their noteworthy Tarot of
Prague for our article library -- and to
provide a bit of a "sneak peek" into a couple of
their upcoming projects as well. Tarot Garden's
Dan Pelletier corresponded with Karen and Alex
to compile the following interview.
Q: Tell us a bit about yourselves.
Karen: Yes, you're right of course,
that's a good place to begin. We are both
inclined to be quite private, which is why we've
put so little about ourselves on our web site.
However, to begin (as I'd
better begin somewhere): Alex is from Yalta, in
the Crimea -- a beautiful part of Russia on the
Black Sea and with a warm Mediterranean climate
(though it's now part of the Ukraine in fact,
but Alex is Russian - calling him Ukrainian
would be a bit like calling a Scotsman
English!).
I'm from Belfast, but
moved to England when I was seventeen - my
parents hated "the troubles" and decided to move
away. I'm still an unashamed "peacenik" - being
brought up with violence can make you
particularly opposed to all forms of it.
I have had connections
with Prague going back some years. Some of these
are family connections, and I've also worked
here a few times (most memorably doing a
week-long session teaching Georgians web design
skills about five years ago - challenging and
lots of fun). I found that the more I came here,
the more attached to the place I became. When
one evening I flew out of Prague in tears, I
realized my emotions were telling me something
that it took a while for my rational brain to go
along with -- that I really wanted to live here!
At about the same time, I
had one of those opportunities in life that are
born of what seem like misfortune (my mother
always says that when you look back in life,
many of the things you thought were horribly bad
luck turn out to be very positive turning
points). I was running my own successful and
quite large web design company in the center of
London, but the work suddenly began to dry up
dramatically when the "dot-com bust" happened in
2000/2001. I have to admit that after my initial
worries, I saw this as one huge relief, and a
kind of excuse to do what I wanted to anyway. So
I "moth-balled" the company (we never actually
went out of business and we were very careful to
offer the employees every support), gave what
clients/jobs I still had to the guys who wanted
to carry on -- and, as a good friend said, "ran
away to Prague to begin the great adventure."
I'll also say, as this is
a tarot audience so you won't think it sounds
odd, that I also had some deep-down feeling that
I somehow had to go to Prague. I did do a
reading before I finally moved here and it said
-- twice (yes, I did what I shouldn't and made a
second reading to check, as I was so surprised!)
that I would meet a man with whom I would both
fall in love with and work. This seemed very
unlikely, and was not at all what I had in mind,
so I didn't think much more about it. Then, just
two months after coming here, a friend said he
knew a Russian designer who I should meet. All I
can say is - the cards were right!
Alex: So as you
already know I am Russian. A bit unpredictable,
a bit weird, a bit too emotional with very
strong feelings about doing what I love to do no
matter what people around me think about it. I
came to Prague with an Eastern wind, bringing
only books and tools with me. It was my hope to
find something very unusual to do. When I was
young, I was reading European fairy tales and I
was imagining Prague as mysterious city full of
unusual smells, sounds and lights -- possibly
even magicians and ghosts. Sometimes it seems to
be true in Prague. So I believed if you have a
dream and you want it to come true, follow your
heart. Even it doesn't seem very sensible.
I have been trained in art
for 13 years (proper Russian education system!),
so I have much, sometimes useless, knowledge in
design. I took a psychology course at the Art
college and a philosophy course at the
University.
I think this helped me to
keep afloat when I was doing very boring
advertising work. I was selling the surrealistic
painting of my Russian friend at the same time
to cheer myself up. Then I met Karen and
realized that she is an unusual as me (which I
couldn't believe in the beginning). Then we
quite quickly understood we should stick
together doing what we both love, because it's
like meeting a yeti -- it doesn't happen
everyday in your life. And I feel absolutely
happy mixing art, mystery, symbolism, and
philosophy every single day of my life.
The Chariot from
the Tarot of Prague
Three of Cups from
the Tarot of Prague
Four of Wands from
the Tarot of Prague
Two of Swords from
the Tarot of Prague
|
Q: Why a Tarot of Prague?
What was the impetus for creating such
a deck?
Karen: Well, Prague is a
focal point, but it's also more than
that. It's a very unusual place, right
at the center of the continent and a
real crossing point of East and West
Europe. Notoriously, it just grabs some
people. As Kafka said, "Prague is a
dear mother with claws," and it tends
to keep pulling them back. So what I'm
saying is that both Alex and I are here
partly for rational reasons and partly
for emotional ones. We were grabbed by
the city, definitely.
So, what was the impetus for
creating the deck? I'd say first that
it isn't just based on architectural
imagery. We wanted the cards to really
communicate how Prague feels, so we
used the art and landscape as well as
the architecture. This may seem a small
point, but to us it's quite an
important one. There was a real range
of imagery, including simply the
amazing views that you get all over the
city, that we wanted to include.
Why a deck about Prague? To begin
with, it's one powerful way for us to
work through our own feelings about the
place -- that was one of the primary
reasons for doing the deck. Also, the
project allowed us to draw on our
complementary skills. Alex is really
the person who can put images together
visually, while I tend to focus on the
outline design -- broadly what should
be in each image, what the "tone"
should be. We liked the fact that tarot
also let us use our mutual interests in
myth, fairy-story and symbolism in a
way that little other work could.
But first and foremost, Prague
simply should have a deck. I'd seen
some of the decks designed for other
towns and cities (mostly in Italy and
France) and Alex and I both knew that
Prague has a much deeper and richer
tradition of magic and the esoteric
than almost anywhere else in Europe.
For example, it really was the absolute
center of alchemy in Europe during the
reign of Rudolph II. I have to say that
one thing that really provoked us into
doing the deck in 2002/3 was the
thought that if we didn't, someone else
would -- and maybe in a way that
wouldn't do the city justice. I suppose
we felt (I hope this isn't arrogance)
that we would probably do it much
better than someone who just wanted to
produce a deck as a tourist thing.
Alex: For me, the process
started when I began to take photos,
because it was an astonishing time of
discovering treasures. It was like
finding a goldmine of imagery. At some
points I felt like a madman who
couldn't stop photographing. At every
step, there was so much that I wasn't
sure how to deal with it all. Of
course, it was difficult when I
realized that some photographs I
thought would be easy to use actually
didn't go very well with each other --
because they were different styles,
epochs, medias and so on. So the
hardest thing was to find the right
style with which to work with these
images. I had to solve the problem of
putting things together. I don't mean
that in the technical or mechanical
sense; putting them together in
Photoshop was easy. The issue was to
make them work together visually. It
wasn't like doing classical collage, in
which you use only scissors and
fantasy.
The most difficult card for me --
the one that took the longest time
before it worked the way I had imagined
it -- was The Tower. The image wasn't
difficult to create once we had the
parts, but as we didn't want to use
Photoshop effects for the flames, the
big problem was first to find a
suitable picture to use. In the end we
found it: a very small, original
painting in the library of the Strahov
monastery.
Technically, some examples of the
most difficult cards (in terms of
creating the artwork, redrawing the
images, combining the elements, etc.)
were:
- The Three of Cups
- The Nine of Cups
- The Four of Wands
- The Three of Wands
- The Six of Wands
- The King of Swords
This was usually because the
original images were in such bad
condition due to dampness, decay, or
dirt that I had to digitally restore
them before even beginning to work with
them.
By the way, my favorite cards are:
- The King of Swords
- The King of Cups
- The Queen of Cups
- The Knight of Swords
Oh - they are all Court Cards!
|
Q: In a Tarot deck, we have
78 images. When you began your
creation, did the ideas for all of
the cards fall into place? Did you
find that a few were difficult? Can
you tall me a little about how the
process for creation actually
occurred?
Karen: The honest answer
is that in the early days, the ideas
didn't fall into place very easily.
By Christmas 2002, we thought we had
most of the deck finished. But after
we took a break and looked again, we
actually scrapped about 80-90% of
that work and began all over again.
That was a hard moment because it
felt like wasting so much work. But
we knew that this first batch of
cards just didn't gel either
symbolically or visually. In fact,
once we steeled ourselves to begin
again, it turned out to be much
easier. Probably because we had
gained a lot of experience and
become more focused on what we
really wanted to achieve.
We had particular problems with
some cards. I'm not sure why
exactly, but I think most deck
creators will tell you that they get
blocked on certain cards. For us, it
was the Knight of Swords in
particular. I've told you that I
have a strong belief in
non-violence, so I do half wonder if
that's why I found this particular
card so hard. I can't speak for
Alex, who may want to make his own
comments. Anyway, in the end we
realized The Knight of Swords had to
be Duke Wallenstein (see below). He
made his reputation and his money as
a war leader. His palace, which was
funded by the spoils of war, is
simply full of images of battle --
some of them unusually graphic for
this period.
We had to almost completely draw
the original picture of Wallenstein
to make it suitable for this card.
But even so, it made sense for us to
use it. For anyone who knows
anything about his life, the image
gives a very deep resonance to this
card. Opinions are mixed as to
whether the Duke was a good or bad
man (if such a question is even
meaningful). What is certain is that
he was highly intelligent -- a
brilliant General, but also totally
ruthless. A very suitable figure for
the Knight.
I suppose this example brings up
something else that's worth saying
about the work on this deck. We felt
all the time that we had to think
(and feel) hard about how to balance
three things:
- Meaningful and layered
symbolism -- we wanted symbolism
that would go on revealing itself
over time, rather than always
being immediately apparent.
- Strong visual imagery -- each
card had to work as a total
image, but they also had to work
together, even though they
incorporated such varied periods,
styles and media. We didn't try
to make them totally visually
consistent with one another (to
our minds, cities are not
visually consistent, and that's
part of their charm and
interest), but we did want a
broad, "family" feel across the
whole deck.
- A true representation of
Prague -- this meant that certain
images simply had to be included,
which was sometimes hard. For
example, if we had not included
Vysehrad, the mythical foundation
of Prague, it would have felt
like leaving out an important
part of the story of the city.
Yet it was actually quite hard to
include this area meaningfully.
We spent many hours
photographing, but found that
only a little was useable.
During the design process, there
were wonderful moments of
click, when we would suddenly
realize that a powerful local symbol
was also perfect for a particular
card. The bronze relief we used on
the Ten of Pentacles is a good
example. It is such an icon in
Prague, and for a while we couldn't
see how to use it. Of course, once
we realized how it would fit with
this card it just seemed so obvious
-- it's perfect. It works on
numerous levels too, all of which
help to enrich the possible readings
of the image. But it's funny how it
can take you a long time sometimes
to recognize this sort of match. I
was so used to knowing that bronze
relief in a whole different context
(usually with crowds of people
waiting in turn to touch it) that I
just couldn't see what was under my
nose. Interesting!
|
|
 
|
|
Above left: Painting of the
Duke of Wallenstein. Above
right: Knight of Swords card from
the Tarot of Prague.
|
|
|
|
|
Q: I'd like to chat about the
book that you can get with the deck.
Personally I love the book, it's one of
the best books that I've ever see to
have available with the deck. The
'side' histories and stories provide
much more richness to the deck.
Do you have any stories you'd
like to share about writing the
book?
Karen: Well, it's interesting
you should ask about the book. When I
was writing it, I thought of it very
much as just a necessary explanation of
the deck, and therefore as something
that would simply enhance the knowledge
and enjoyment of the deck.
I expected it to be a long pamphlet
rather than anything else. But as I
wrote it began to grow -- and grow! In
the end, I actually had to edit it down
to a reasonable size. I was slightly
amazed when I really sat down and
thought about how much the book took
over and drew me in.
It became, for me, a very absorbing
project in its own right. Prague has a
fascinating -- and sometimes tragic --
history, and the more I read and saw,
the more I wanted to find out. I was at
one time a research fellow in a
university, so I'm reasonably trained
at research -- which really just means,
in part, being able to take in and
evaluate material efficiently. This did
help me a lot as I found the quality of
research in the books I read did vary
quite a bit. I did as much
crosschecking as possible, since I
really didn't want our book to simply
rehash old mistakes. For example, there
is a lot of rubbish written about the
alchemists -- where they lived, what
they did, etc. -- and it took a lot of
work to sort out the truth from the
myth. But it was enthralling work to
do.
I was really relieved when our
Prague Post interviewer complemented us
on the accuracy of the book -- and in
fact said it was better than most
guidebooks written. At that point, I
relaxed a bit! I really did want to do
Prague justice and felt vindicated by
the review -- especially as our
reviewer is notoriously critical and
does know a lot about local history and
belief.
Of course, companion books have to
do two rather contradictory things.
First, they have to work as a basic
introduction to tarot for people who
have never come across a deck before.
Many of our buyers are visitors to the
city and for them it may be a first
deck. That's why I put in some easily
accessible keywords and summary
introductions. Of course these things
won't take anyone very far into
interpretations, but at least it lets
them begin.
But companion books also have to
offer something to people who know
tarot well and already have their own
methods of reading the cards. I think
it's the background of the elements we
used that give this range and depth for
experienced readers. You can read the
images entirely intuitively, without
knowing anything about them, but I do
think that if you begin to understand
where each piece comes from then it can
usefully (and hopefully excitingly)
start whole new trains of thought and
imagination.
|
Nine of Pentacles from
the Tarot of Prague
The Tower from
the Tarot of Prague
Four of Swords from
the Tarot of Prague
|
Q: Have you heard any stories of
'oddities' occurring with the
deck?
Karen: Personally, I think
any feeling of a special "magic" in
the deck is simply drawn from the
images. Many of the elements we used
have their own very strong history,
and I think users pick this up,
consciously or subconsciously.
Alex: My belief is that
things are able to accumulate a
certain kind of energy (emotional,
psychic, etc.), even though I don't
know how, or what kind of energy it
is. It's similar to the way that, if
you like what you're cooking, the
food will be fantastic -- it has a
different energy about it. It's the
same as that.
Going to rational things: we know
from school that energy doesn't
disappear, but instead transforms
into different sorts of energy. So I
think real objects in some moments
can transfer their energy in some
ways to an audience. And it depends
on people; some of them are more
subtle, some are able to feel it.
Why is it that people looking at
the same painting, landscape or
whatever, may see different objects
and get quite different impressions?
It's like the "Jaguar in the
Window" that one person reported
seeing in our Four of Swords card.
We didn't see that possible
interpretation until we heard about
it. But when we looked again, we saw
it. There is indeed the face of a
jaguar in the window. So designing
cards is partly about provoking
people to find what we didn't see or
mean ourselves. There are so many
cultural, historical, and creative
levels in symbols that sometimes
it's a very difficult task to
understand why a symbol looks so
weird and what background is
underneath. And the reason for that,
I think, is that the world is
flexible. It is comprised of moving
matter, which transforms things even
without you acting on them, as if
things begin living their own lives
and you may only watch what happens.
So I am looking forward to seeing
new facts and discoveries about
Tarot of Prague deck.
Karen:In thinking about
this question about the deck and
oddities, it brings to mind some
incidents that might be called
coincidental or significant
happenings. We've had some very odd
things happen here, but I never talk
about them -- or at most, only the
slighter ones. For example, someone
came in the other day and asked me
where the gate of Hell is supposed
to be in Prague, and I didn't tell
her. In fact, if you know local
mythology -- well, you can kind of
work it out. But the friend (a very
interesting and quite wild
Tartarian) who showed it to us
expressly asked us not to show it to
others. He absolutely believed that
it is a dangerous place at night and
I suppose I have to respect that.
I treat odd happenings in general
with that kind of respect. In one
sense I think, "Oh come on, this is
rationally explicable." But in other
ways -- well, I'm Irish, and still
have a half-belief that if you talk
too much you may lose the magic. One
way or another, there are things I
chose not to speak about -- not in
order to be mysterious, but more to
protect and respect. In short, I'd
simply say: if you want to know
about Prague and strange happenings,
come here and see for yourself.
There are so many stories about
experiences people have had here --
but I think for each individual the
experience will be different. I
don't believe it's a matter of "go
to this street at this time and you
will see this ghost." Nothing so
silly or crass as that. The things
I've heard about Prague that
interest me are much more subtle and
more special to each particular
person.
I sometimes think the city has
ways of letting certain people
visualize their imaginings. For
some, this is a frightening
experience, for others a beautiful
one. You have to remember how old
and labyrinthine this place is.
The other day, I found a whole
flight of ancient stairs -- quite
wide and built of stone. I'd never
seen them before, and yet they are
very close to where we live. This
physical sense of hidden places and
the disorientation that the
complexity of streets and buildings
can bring about do seem, in some
way, to free (or puzzle) people's
minds. The Moon card relates very
well to Prague!
There are two valid approaches to
all this, of course. One is the
"there are more things in heaven and
hell...," which would acknowledge
that unexplained things do happen
(and might be concentrated around
certain objects, places, dates, or
people). The other would say that
this is all in fact, perfectly logic
and rational.
Taking the latter approach, I'd
say that the reason people think our
cards have a lot of energy in them
may simply be because they use a
wide variety of very old and
powerful symbols from an ancient
city -- symbols which in some senses
have been "tried and tested" over
time and so do carry the ability to
move many people. When we made the
deck, we very much wanted to capture
and communicate this aspect of
Prague. It is really full of signs
and symbols that, in their own
right, evoke a response.
In the end, I don't want to come
down firmly as either a believer or
a rationalist. I am still trying to
work out for myself what I do
believe. I'm completely happy for
people to use our cards whatever
their beliefs. If you think they
carry magic, that's good. But if you
think they are simply good-looking
images that draw on a lot of
historical images and symbols, then
that's great too. Whatever works for
you.
|
|
|
|
The Chariot from
the Baroque Bohemian Cats' Tarot
The World from an as-yet untitled
tarot
by Zdenek Mezl
|
Q: What's in store for the
future?
Karen: Of course we'd like to
share this. However, as yet we have
very little to show. We're actually
working on two decks. One we have had
planned for some time: The Baroque
Bohemian Cats' Tarot. It is still
in sketch stage, and we are reluctant
to show the sketches publicly as they
are very rough and give the wrong
impression. However, there are two that
are almost complete and will give an
idea of the proposed deck's "flavor."
The deck uses real cats, some of whom
we've come to know well. We want to
create a fantasy world, something a
little like a dream or a story. It's
very important to us (as ever) that
this is a reading deck, so although
it's light in many ways, it will also
have some serious symbolism.
The other deck came very
unexpectedly. For some time Alex and I
have both been very interested in the
work of Zdenek Mezl, an artist here who
has a very distinctive style and uses
woodblocks of lace-like fineness. His
work is technically breathtaking, but
equally important is the fact that he
draws on many old symbols and
traditions -- but in quite a feisty,
modern way. We were delighted to find
in his work many of the symbols we used
in Tarot of Prague -- but redrawn in
woodblocks.
When we first met him, there was a
mutual enjoyment in finding these
elements to which we'd all been
attracted. We also realized that we had
many of the same books -- although I
have to say that Mezl has some old and
rare books on the history of cards that
I've never seen and would give much
for. He did a set of Oracle cards in
1967 (the time of the brief liberation
known as the "Prague Spring"), and more
recently, a set of Czech Taroky cards.
In any case, we found we have much
in common. But we also realized that he
is now a very ill man who urged us to
work quickly if we want his active
collaboration. So this is why this new
deck has had to be started much sooner
than we would have planned. It won't be
an 'easy' deck. But I think it will
have a tremendous life and vitality.
It's an absolute privilege to be able
to work with Zdenek Mezl. He feels his
work has rarely been understood outside
this Czech region. I do hope we can now
bring it to a wider audience -- and I
think a tarot audience will understand
the sheer quality of his work far
better than most people could.
|
The Tarot Garden is proud to offer the
Tarot of Prague in our online catalog.
Click
here for more information.
© Karen Mahoney, Alex
Ukolov, and Dan Pelletier
24 January 2004
|
|
